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Kent Hovind

Should Kent Hovind be on this list? Is he actually a scientist? Philip J. Rayment 14:58, 26 Oct 2004 (GMT)

Is being a 'scientist' a prerequisite for being a 'creation scientist'? You can be a latter-day saint without being a saint, a spin doctor without being a doctor, and a sealion without being a lion (or a seal). User:rthearle

Very amusing rthearle, but comments like these are not helpful. Philip J. Rayment, if he's not a scientist then he shouldn't be on the list. Maybe we could make another list of famous creationists or something - Phillip Johnson is a lawyer if I remember correctly. User:Msaward

The CreationWiki article on Kent Hovind doesn't list any scientific qualifications, and I couldn't find any on Hovind's web-site. I gather that he was a maths/science teacher or something like that. Yes, another list would be a good idea. As well as Hovind and Johnson that could include Ken Ham, who is probably similar to Kent Hovind in being a former maths/science teacher. AiG list Ken Ham in their list of speakers, but not their list of scientists. Philip J. Rayment 23:03, 26 Oct 2004 (GMT)

I didnt add him to the list, but based on the information I've gather, it appears he has a PhD in Education. Having a graduate degree in a science discipline should be the minimum qualification, therefore I will remove him from the list. If you want to start compiling another list of "speakers", that would be great. I've already created a bio page for Johnson. User:ashcraft

There is now a link to this page from a very high volume website and so you might want to fill in the uncompleted biographies

There is now a link to this page from a very high volume website and so you might want to fill in the uncompleted biographies. The link is from and the link is located here: If I am not mistaken, Conservapedia has not been up that long and it already got over 1,000,000 views and their Theory of Evolution article is their 3rd most viewed page (that page also has a link to CreationWiki). So again, you might want to update this page. Creationist 22:16, 5 March 2007 (EST)creationist

Leonardo da Vinci

Interesting that Leonardo da Vinci is listed as a Historical Creation Scientist, but I don't think he belongs in this list... The list claims to contain "people [who] are historic creation scientists. During their life they had a firm belief in God and either possessed one or more graduate degrees in a science discipline or contributed substantially to the field of science." Althought he defenitely contributed substantially to the field of science, he was known to be an atheïst. This is supported by the fact that he wrote articles on almost every scientific subject, except theology. --F. Gonggrijp 07:56, 22 June 2007 (EDT)

Definition of "scientist"

For the purposes of this page, does a medical doctor count as a scientist? Detschko Svilenov, a medical doctor, has just been added to the list of non-scientists, while Carl Wieland, also a medical doctor (no longer practising) is listed under scientists. Philip J. Rayment 05:05, 18 December 2010 (PST)

A scientist is probably one who regularly pursues a line of research, using the sort of exact measurements, sampling, separation, and so on that people normally associate with laboratory science. A physician does not normally perform this kind of research.--TemlakosTalk 05:10, 18 December 2010 (PST)
The creation scientist list is defined to include creationists with a Masters degree or higher in a science discipline.--Ashcraft - (talk) 14:54, 18 December 2010 (PST)
Okay, but does a medical qualification count as a "science discipline"? Philip J. Rayment 18:49, 18 December 2010 (PST)
Yes - medicine is considered a specialization or subdiscipline of Biology. Carl Wieland's bio should remain in the creation scientist list. --Ashcraft - (talk) 17:19, 19 December 2010 (PST)
Thanks for the clarification. And I didn't realise that Svilenov was already listed in the Scientists list. Philip J. Rayment 16:12, 24 December 2010 (PST)

Use SMW?

Wouldn't this page be a good candidate for using SMW? That is, flag each article about a creationist with an appropriate property, then this page could use SMW queries to list all those articles/people. Admittedly the problem of including those who don't have articles would need to be addressed, but that problem should not be insurmountable. Philip J. Rayment 16:22, 24 December 2010 (PST)

Defining Well Known

The Non-Scientist list says a person should be well-known for inclusion. How is this defined? As an example, would Russ Miller from Creation, Science, and Evolution Ministries be considered well known? For comparison, Ian Juby (on the list) seems more popularly known, but gets less web traffic to his site than Miller. There are some I know that might be added to the list, but I do not know if they are popular enough. --Towiel 04:25, 26 April 2011 (PDT)

Acknowledged. Popularity should not be an issue. The site should support creation missionaries regardless of how extensive their effective area might be. I've changed the inclusionary statements as follows.
The following is a list of persons (non-scientists) who are actively and substantially involved in creation missions.

--Ashcraft - (talk) 08:51, 26 April 2011 (PDT)